“There is an ambiguity built into these stories and that’s why we like them.”

Karolina Waclawiak in Conversation With the Creators of the Podcast Criminal 

Criminal is a new podcast about crime created by Phoebe Judge, Eric Mennel and Lauren Spohrer. Each month, the podcast delivers complicated and surprising stories from  “people who’ve done wrong, been wronged, or gotten caught somewhere in the middle.“ Less interested in the mainstream sensationalism of crime, Criminal inhabits the grey areas and will leave you wrestling with ethical and moral questions.

I chatted with the creators of Criminal over email about stories as far ranging as peculiar murders at the “hands” of animals, Venus flytrap crime rings, cold cases, and more.

—Karolina Waclawiak

I. FOR THE PEOPLE DRIVING HOME ALONE AT 1AM

THE BELIEVER: Let’s start at the beginning. When did an interest in crime begin for all of you?

LAUREN SPOHRER: About six years ago I binged on Raymond Chandler, and reading so many of his novels in quick succession really did something to me. I had been reading a lot of esoteric literary fiction that had no plot, and these novels felt like medicine. I worked my way through the big names of that era—Cornell Woolrich, Patricia Highsmith, Dashiell Hammett. My favorite is The Murder of Roger Ackroyd by Agatha Christie. These novels are formal and mannered, and Phoebe has a pretty formal voice, and we were interested in bringing that elegant, somewhat old-fashioned mood to true stories.

PHOEBE JUDGE: I’ve always loved crime. I grew up in Chicago, and when I was a little girl I’d listen to the police scanner. Now you can get a police scanner app on your iPhone, so I still listen sometimes to see what’s going on there.

ERIC MENNEL: Honestly, it started about nine months ago, when Phoebe and Lauren asked “Do you want to do a show about crime?” I think I have a general interest in good stories and often crimes are great stories. Though I have always had an interest in the legal system, and I guess Criminal is really just the less academic version of that.

BLVR: And, how was the podcast conceived? You all have a background in public radio, what brought you all together to make this particular show?

PJ: We met working together for a public radio show called The Story. The show ended, and we started talking about making something of our own almost immediately. When you work for an existing show, you write and edit and think in terms of a specific broadcast clock. You think in terms of the mission of the show, and its host, and because of that you’re necessarily limited. We were excited to see what we could make from scratch.

EM: Plus, crime is...