“Aren’t I Making All This Up?”

Photograph by Greg Martin

Adam Baer in Conversation with Clancy Martin

The following is a conversation that I had with writer and philosophy professor Clancy Martin, whose new book is Love and Lies: An Essay on Truthfulness, Deceit, and the Growth and Care of Erotic Love. Martin has also worked in the jewelry business and written fiction. His first novel, How to Sell, details the schemes of shady diamond guys—and Martin’s no stranger to confidence scams. But he gets confessional in Love and Lies, combining philosophy with stories about his romantic life, and it’s his contention that one must lie in order to carry on a successful relationship. Don’t lie to yourself as you consider the truthfulness of the discussion below, and see Martin speak in a few YouTube videos that he has provided us to prove that he is indeed someone who has been recorded while giving philosophical discussions.

—Adam Baer

I. TELLING THE TRUTH BUT TELLING IT SLANT

ADAM BAER: Let me start the conversation with a lie and say that I don’t believe in being truthful with your loved ones.

CLANCY MARTIN: You have to take the risk of being truthful with people you love. But always examine your motivations. Are you seeking the good for that person when you speak the truth? Or are you just clearing your conscience? Are you using truth as a weapon? Truth can hurt just as much as a lie—sometimes more.

AB: My loved ones generally say I’m a bad liar. They even know that I crack up when I’m telling the truth in a situation that would cause others to expect a lie.

CM: Well, you’re probably a much better liar than you think, Adam. Nietzsche writes that “lying to others, relatively speaking, is an exceptional event. We most often lie, and we learn to lie, by lying to ourselves.” So very often when we think we are being sincere, or speaking the truth, we may have already engaged in a prior convenient self-deception.

I think we must be very attuned to our own thoughts and feelings before we can feel confident that we are speaking truthfully—especially when it comes to matters of love. Sometimes, in order to care for a beloved, you might need to lie. I might ask you to lie to me to tell me what I need to hear.

AB: Seems like I should be careful. I’m not fact-checking your philosophy quotes.

CM: Put any two people in conversation for ten minutes and they will lie two or three times.

AB:  Okay, but I’m not saying that I trust people most...